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Let me guess, it was in the middle of that 6 game loosing streak...when no one was paying attention outta disgust?
Injuries and attrition can really hurt a program. In that sense, luck definitely plays a certain role in a program's success. Additionally, this applies to all programs, but you really need to know what you're doing from an evaluation standpoint. There are so many busts every single year. No one is ever going to be perfect, but there are a lot of schools that should be a lot better than they are. If a program can be at that level, they should have a steady stream of talented depth on the roster at all times.
Regarding recruiting, even when it comes to the coaches that are good at it, I'd still estimate that 75% of them don't like it. They do it because it's a major part of the job, and they'll never succeed as a program - or in their individual career - without recruiting well. There's so much happening behind the scenes at all times that even the best recruiters have to grow weary of the process after a few years. But 99% of coaches are in coaching to actually coach - in meetings, at practice and during games. They put up with recruiting as a necessary evil. That's not to say they don't enjoy certain aspects of recruiting, but in terms of enjoying the whole process, I don't think many of them do.
Some of us only have time to read the headlines on VOTH once or twice daily. Thats probably why so many of us missed it.
Couple more cats that are outta the bag.
KF Presser tomorrow at 2 pm.
Ross P said in a recent interview that he will probably visit some west coast and southern schools.
Friday at 2.
No doubt that recruiting can make even the best recruiters grow weary of the process. Once they finally get a much needed and highly regarded recruit to commit, the job is far from over. A recruit can commit in June and after continuing to to stay in contact with him on a weekly/daily basis and after developing a very close bond with him and his family, the recruit can still decommit the day before NSD without any warning, leaving the school in a bad situation and the recruiter looking foolish. No matter how much money a coach makes, a situation like that can really make a coach disillusioned with the whole process. However, they still have a number of other recruits they have to keep on board, plus they are also reaching out to recruits in the next years class, all the while performing all of their day to day coaching duties. It is a never ending process, and honestly I don't think I could handle it. It takes a very driven and relentless person to do this job season after season and be successful at it.
This post was edited by TheJungles 17 months ago
Exactly. That's why I doubt there are too many college coaches that really like recruiting as a whole, especially once they've been around for 2-3 years or more.
"I think it's a much better use of time and resources to focus even more heavily on a state like Ohio or Pennsylvania, where Iowa can be a realistic contender for the top prospects."
I don't recall any "top prospects" that Ohio State or PSU have lost to Iowa. I could be wrong, but the top 25 players in Ohio and Penn. are going to OSU, MI, MSU, PSU, Pitt, WVA, etc... Iowa was landing about as many "top players" from FL as they were from Ohio and Penn. If you look at the guys they landed from Ohio, none that I can recall were top 10 players that the Buckeyes or Wolverines wanted. How is it any more realistic to expect Iowa to pull top talent from these states than from FL?
It is a HUGE mistake to just say that they aren't going to recruit one of the top football states in the country. Some of the players that end up going to UCF, South Florida, UAB, FAU and other smaller regional schools down there are exactly the type of players Iowa should go after. No way are they going to land huge Florida 5 star guys, but they should be expected to land 3 star guys every year. Those 3 star guys in FL are arguably better than midwest 3 star guys in a lot of cases. Let's be honest, they play better football at the HS level in that state just like they do in Ohio and Texas. Just my opinion, but I think this is what is wrong with the B1G. Defeatist attitudes and complacent coaching. Down vote me if you must, but I just can't believe coaches at Iowa are actually saying they aren't going to recruit a top 5 state for football. What a bunch of crap!
This post was edited by Apax77 17 months ago
Exactly! I would upvote you many times if I could.
Say what you want about Urban Meyer criticizing his fellow coaches, but he has a point. Kirk Ferentz will show him. You tell me to step up my recruiting? I will show you by not recruiting in one prime fb rich states. LOL.
I think you're misunderstanding my point here. Of course Iowa won't beat out OSU for an Ohio kid or Penn State for a PA kid. Just like Iowa won't beat out Florida, FSU or Miami for a Florida kid. But Iowa does have a realistic chance to land a large percentage of Ohio kids that aren't offered by OSU or Michigan, and there are a ton of great players that fall into that category. Same thing goes for the state of Pennsylvania. On the other hand, Iowa is way, way back in the pecking order in Florida - behind Florida, FSU, Miami, USF, the entire SEC, the entire ACC, Ohio State, Michigan, some Big 12 schools and some PAC 12 schools. I think Iowa can get more quantity and quality on a consistent basis in OH and PA.
He may have been, but it's hard to tell because when you use examples such as Miles, Paschal and Sims, it sort of defeats your argument since they were all starters and successful contributors to the program.
Overall, I actually agree that the percentages haven't been great with Iowa over the years......too many academic casaulties, defections and transfers.
Someone in the know told me Gary Swenson makes about $100K teaching at WDM Valley.
He teaches phys ed.
There was a article today on ESPN.com by Adam Rittenberg regarding this topic. Here's an excerpt:
"We're talking about Florida, right? The state that produced four of the top six players and 22 of the top 100 players in the 2013 class, according to ESPN Recruiting? The state often grouped with Texas and California as the nation's top recruiting hotbeds? Yes, that Florida. All but two Big Ten teams (Iowa and Michigan) signed at least one Floridian earlier this month. Indiana and Purdue both signed five. I'm still waiting for a good reason for Iowa to back away from Florida. Sure, Iowa has had a run of bad luck with Florida recruits. But should it stop trying? I can think of 22 reasons -- and many more from the 2013 class -- to keep investing time and money there. Big Ten teams can't expect to compete at a national elite level by recruiting solely in the Midwest. Prioritizing states like Florida -- along with Georgia, Texas and California -- is a must for Big Ten programs. "
Iowa's 2012 recruiting class included two Floridians in wide receiver Greg Mabin (Fort Lauderdale) and defensive end Daumantas Venckus-Cucchiara (West
Thanks for the link.
Guess Rittenberg missed the memo too.
Cats outta the bag.
Thanks for the info on Swenson.
As usual, I disagree with Rittenberg. I think an argument can be made that Ferentz should have aggressively sought at least one coach with deep ties to Florida to fill these recent vacancies. But without anyone with those ties on staff, I just don't think it's an efficient thing for Iowa to do. I completely disagree with his belief that you can't compete on a national stage by recruiting in the midwest. There are a ton of kids that slip through the cracks in Ohio and Pennsylvania every year, for a variety of reasons. If a program knows what it's doing from an evaluation standpoint, a school like Iowa can ultimately land more talent than schools that are traditionally higher in the college football pecking order.
Todd, to your point, you are correct that Iowa could land guys that slip through the cracks each year in OH, PA, etc... But if you relying on catching the leftovers and guys that the big schools don't feel good about, you'd better never miss on them. How many 2 and 3 star guys are actually diamonds in the rough? I know Iowa has a good history of finding and developing more than their fair share, but that is a VERY fine line they are walking. A few bad years of missing on some guys and the program turns into Akron, who also signs the guys from Ohio that bigger schools don't want. Just saying...
There's a lot more talent in those states than you're giving them credit for. There are a bunch of high three-star or low four-star players in those states that don't get offered by OSU or Michigan, and a lot of those guys are rated too low by sites like ours, Rivals and Scout, IMO. First of all, only 10 of Ohio State's 24 signees in the 2013 class were Ohioans. I think that's a bad mistake on Meyer's part, but that's another discussion for another thread. Under Tressel, the number would have been much higher. In recent years, a lot of those kids from Ohio that OSU and Michigan passed on ended up at Michigan State, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana, Minnesota, Northwestern, Nebraska, Cincinnati, etc. If Iowa plays its cards right and can win a lot of battles for these types of kids, the Hawkeyes will have a legitimate chance to contend for a conference title every year. I didn't think Iowa was aggressive enough in Ohio or Pennsylvania in the 2012 class, but Brian Ferentz did an outstanding job in Ohio for the 2013 class. If Iowa can improve upon that, and do the same in Pennsylvania, I really think that's the most effective approach to take.
Well here would be my choices, here in Ohio, for them to go after...in no particular order.
1.) Dareian Watkins 6'2 192 lbs 4☆ ATH Galion
2.) Darius West 5'11, 190 lbs 4☆ DB Lima Central Catholic
3.) Ethan Wolf 6'6 225 lbs 4☆ TE Minster
4.) Adam Bertke 6'5 200 lbs 4☆ Pro-QB Maria Stein Marion Local
5.) L.J. Scott 6'0 215 lbs 3☆ RB Marion Harding
6.) Verondtae Wilkinson 6'2 220 lbs 4☆ OLB/DE Trotwood Madison
7.) Nick Richardson 6'5 285 lbs 4☆ OT Westerville Central
8.) Davonte James 6'3 220 lbs 4☆ ILB Springfield
9.) Tinashe Bere 6'1 210 lbs 3☆ ILB Cincinnati Sycamore
10.) Daniel Cage 6'3 275 lbs 3-4☆ DT Cincinnati Winton Woods
11.) Joe Henderson 6'4 220 lbs 4☆ DE Cleveland Shaker Heights
12.) Nathan Hall 6'3 200 lbs 4☆ ATH Sylvania Southview
The problem is, Iowa is so far behind the offerings of a lot of other B1G schools, not necessarily Tosu, but Mich, Mich St, Illinois. Penn St and even West Virgina, Pitt and Kentucky that its gonna be that much harder for them to get a commitment. The first guy on this list to get an offer was the guy with the lowest rating in Bere. That's not gonna cut it. There are better players to be had, but here in Ohio anyway, they are being too slow, IMO. But hey, enjoy the cruise.
I think that's a fair criticism about being too slow to offer at times. You're absolutely right that Iowa can't afford to be the 7th BCS school (for example) to offer a kid from that far away and have a realistic chance of landing him.
Times have changed. KF needs to offer a kid, then do the background stuff to see if there is a reason to pull it. Cannot afford to do things the other way around anymore. Sadly.
I agree with you in general. What's interesting is that I've observed a number of situations where Iowa offers a kid without ever having even spoken with him or meeting him, so there seems to be some exceptions. I really don't have a good answer for why Iowa seems to take longer to offer certain kids. But at the same time, the Hawkeyes have also been the first school to offer a number of kids as well. So I don't think Iowa is necessarily slower on average than other schools are, but may be slower in certain circumstances where it ends up having a negative effect.
Its not the most ethical way but if everyone is evaluating that way and we arent its a disadvantage.
IMO Ferentz wants to play the recruiting game old school. He enjoys the people part of it and is disgusted by the dirty part. He is loyal to a fault and a really high moral guy. It pains me to say but in recruiting now a days nice guys finish last. With his new hires it has become obvious that he loves "good stories" so much that he is willing to pass on some higher trouble risk kids.
It's the recruiting game, you offer every stud out there early, than if they mess up like with trouble you just pull it. What's there to say, yea we pulled an offer cause the kid seem like a red flag ala TrevonYoung, no body argues it.
You recruit & you recruit hard. Hell we should be recruiting the hardest. Why is it we still haven't hired a Player Presonnal Player Director or a recruiting director? Iowa needs to be ahead of the curve, we just started tweeting last year..... inexcusable.
This post was edited by fuisu 17 months ago
That's a pretty solid list. Watkins is a great PR story. Scott is a bull in the LeShun Daniels mold. Wilkinson's old man is Dan "Big Daddy" Wilkinson, overall #1 draft choice out of OSU in 1994 and plays for a program that cranks out D-I recruits. Bertke was all-state D-VI as a defensive back. D-VI is the smallest class in the state but his team's conference is uber-competitive and cranks out about as many D-I recruits as the entire state of Iowa. His team won the D-VI state title and another school in its conference won D-V. Ethan Wolf plays in the same conference. Cage is a moose, plays for a solid program in Cincinnati, as does Bere. Henderson fared well at last summer's Nike Combine in Columbus against 2013 OL prospects. He's got a long, lanky frame, long stride, nice burst but needs to add weight. These are all highly publicized recruits. Iowa should take a swing at them but so will a lot of other schools. Here are a few less publicized prospects:
Mentor's 6-4/210 WR Brandon Fritts was 1st team all-state D-I as a junior. His QB was UNC-bound Mitch Trubisky, who was Ohio's D-I POY as a junior and senior. As a junior, Fritts caught 67 passes for 1,188 yards and 16 TDs. As a soph, he caught 48 passes for 853 yards and 8 TDs. So that's 125 catches for 2,041 yards and 24 TDs in 2 years. He had the game of a lifetime in a 63-56 playoff win against defending D-I St. Ignatius--14 catches, 242 yards and 4 TDs. Not super fast but great hands and a good athlete. He averages 13 ppg in basketball for a 17-3 team, and his older brother's a freshman averaging 16 ppg for D-III Wheeling Jesuit. He has an underwhelming offer list so far--only BGSU, Toledo and Minnesota--but that will change. Iowa would be smart to get on him now. And then there's his team mate, 6-2/190 WR Conner Krizancic, who caught 71 passes for 985 yards and 11 TDs as a junior and 26 catches for 401 yards and 9 TDs as a soph (97 catches, 1,386 yards and 20 TDs). He's averaging 14 ppg in basketball. There may not be a better 1-2 pass-catching combo in the 2014 class. And while Trubisky's gone, 6-6/200 rising senior Kade McClure is ready to step in at Mentor. He didn't have great stats as a junior--11/22 for 102 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT in mop-up duty playing behind arguably the best QB in the state--but he's got great bloodlines as his father, Brian, is Bowling Green's all-time best QB with 900 completions for 10,280 yards. Kade could be the second coming of Ben Roethlisberger, who also only started one year at QB.
And some others worth watching:
6-1/215 LB Conner Kramczyk, Elyria, was 1st team D-I.
6-6/250 TE Chance Sorrell, Middletown. Also plays basketball.
6-1/220 LB Airius Moore, Beavercreek, was 2nd team D-I and has offers from UC and Illinois.
6-4/285 OL Isiah Moore, Tiffin Columbian, was 1st team D-II.
6-0/170 RB Tyree Elliott, Mt. Healthy, was 1st team D-II with 1,145 yards on 105 carries (10.9 ypc) and 17 TDs for a 9-2 team.
6-3/241 DE Tito Odenigbo, Centerville, played alongside Brant Gressel; his brother, Ifeadi, was Northwestern's #1 2012 recruit.
6-4/215 QB Chris Durkin, Youngstown Ursuline, has offers from MSU, Indiana, Illinois and Northwestern.
6-2/215 LB Chris Frey, Upper Arlington, has offers from Syracuse and a half-dozen MAC schools and expecting an offer from Purdue.
6-0/170 ATH Marcus Whitfield, Massillon, plays for a great program, one of the most respected in the state. Only MAC offers so far.
6-5/265 OL Jarrett LaRubbio, Lakota East, has offers from Nebraska, Duke, Kentucky, Pitt and Arizona State.
6-5/230 TE Devin Pike, Cincinnati Elder, had 25 receptions for 278 yards in 7 games. His brother is ex-UC QB Tony Pike.
6-1/225 RB Mikel Horton, Lakota West, had 1,003 yards and 13 TDs, and offers from Kentucky, Indiana and Minnesota.
6-7/310 OL Danny Burns, Fairfield, has offers from Toledo, Pittsburgh and Ohio.
Many of these are kids Jim Tressel might have offered but Urban Meyer more than likely probably won't.
This post was edited by iowabuckeyes 17 months ago
I have no idea what Swenson makes but my kid had him for PE so I can confirm at least that much.
I'm curious why do you "usually" disagree with Rittenberg? Granted, he's CFB's version of John Clayton--guys who couldn't look more unassuming as football experts. They look like they should be analyzing corporate balance sheets rather than athletes. But he seems to have access to good info as one of ESPN's B1G guys.
To the point made earlier by Todd and a few others...
Yes, there is talent in the Midwest and if a coaching staff is good at evaluating and finding talent, then it works to Iowa's advantage.
Iowa just finished 2 disappointing seasons, back to back. This past season was a 4 win, non-bowl qualifying season.
I really don't consider that great staff evaluation of player talent.
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